Hometown Hero Outdoors
Welcome to the Hometown Hero Outdoors Podcast, where we’re more than just a show—we’re a mission. As a non-profit dedicated to enhancing mental health through life-changing outdoor adventures for military service members, veterans, law enforcement officers, firefighters, and EMS personnel, we bring you stories of resilience, healing, and community.
🌲 Why Listen?
- Over 5,000 heroes have experienced the healing power of the outdoors with us—through activities like hunting, fishing, camping, snowmobiling, and more.
- 85% of participants report reduced stress, increased camaraderie, and a renewed sense of purpose after our adventures.
- We share inspiring stories of mental health advocacy and people overcoming the toughest challenges, highlighting the profound impact of reconnecting with nature.
Whether you’re here for thrilling outdoor adventures, meaningful conversations about mental health, or to hear from real people who’ve used the outdoors to heal and grow, this podcast has something for everyone.
🎧 Subscribe now and join us on this journey of healing, resilience, and the transformative power of the great outdoors!
Hometown Hero Outdoors
From Firefighter to Advocate: Scott Gieselhardt's Journey Through PTSD, Addiction, and Hope
Discover the compelling journey of Scott Gieselhardt, a retired firefighter who turned his struggle with PTSD and addiction into a powerful mission to aid mental health awareness among first responders. Scott's 24-year tenure with the Frazee Fire Department in Minnesota exposed him to the emotional complexities and unique pressures faced by first responders, especially in tight-knit communities where emergencies often hit close to home. He joins us on the Hometown Hero Outdoors Podcast to share his transformative story, offering hope and invaluable insights into recognizing and confronting mental health challenges.
Scott's experiences underline the critical role of peer support and innovative therapies like EMDR in recovery, illustrating the profound impact of having a compassionate network. Through heartfelt personal anecdotes, he reveals the emotional toll of invincibility and vulnerability that can lead to substance addiction and mental health struggles. By recounting a life-altering moment of reaching out for help, Scott showcases how human connection can change lives, emphasizing the importance of being present for others in similar crises.
We also explore Scott's influential outreach program "Seeing in Color," which tackles mental health issues among high school students through storytelling and visual transformation. Additionally, Scott shares insights from his work at the First Responder Bridge Retreat, highlighting the vital support offered to first responders and their families. As he continues his advocacy, Scott’s message of resilience and hope serves as a beacon for those navigating their paths to recovery, demonstrating the power of shared experiences in healing and community well-being.
www.seeingincoloragain.com
Produced by Phil Ewert Productions
Theme Music: Hero's Journey
Joel Loopez Tunepocket.com
Licensed by: Phil Ewert Productions
hometownherooutdoors.org
In the land of 10,000 lakes, a remarkable movement was born. Welcome to Hometown Hero Outdoors. We are dedicated to honoring our military service members, veterans and first responders by providing them with unforgettable outdoor recreational opportunities. We believe those who have served and sacrificed so much for our country and communities deserve a chance to reclaim their spirit and find healing in the great outdoors. This is Hometown Hero Outdoors. Welcome to the Hometown Hero Outdoors Podcast. Here is your host.
Speaker 2:Chris Tatro. Hello listeners, welcome back to the Hometown Hero Outdoors podcast. This week we have a special guest named Scott Gieselhardt. Did I say that right?
Speaker 3:Gieselhardt.
Speaker 2:Gieselhardt. I'm sorry, I'm so bad with names. It's okay. Scott is with us this week and we have a pretty good show here. It's a unique one.
Speaker 2:Scott is a former firefighter and a lot of various things, does a lot of public speaking. A former firefighter and a lot of various things, does a lot of public speaking, and I'm just going to go through his bio here to introduce him and then we'll dive into his life and his career and the different things that he's been through to share with everyone and we've had a couple of firefighters on, but I'm pretty excited about having Scott here. So Scott is a 24-year retired firefighter and former assistant chief from the Frazee Fire Department here in Minnesota. He's a mental health practitioner and certified peer support specialist who has received crisis intervention training, suicide prevention training and critical incident stress management training. He worked in mental health crisis stabilization, helping individuals get back on their feet after mental health crisis situations. Scott is a PTSD addiction and suicide attempt survivor. He is now a national speaker who shares his message of healing and redemption with thousands of first responders and other professionals. Scott is a member of the state of North Dakota CIS team and on the state of Minnesota Suicide Prevention Task Force. He has spoken in front of thousands of first responders and other professionals as a keynote speaker at many conferences and events around the country, such as the State Fire Chiefs and Firefighters Conferences, international Association of Fire Chiefs and National Volunteer Fire Council Conferences, emdria Conference, the First Responders Bridge Retreat, first Responders Bridge Retreat. He has many articles that are published, including Fire Rescue 1, fire Engineering, nvfc, help Letter, articles by the Associated Press, and he is also a co-author of the IAFC's Yellow Ribbon Report. Under the Helmet, performing an Internal Size Up, he also speaks at churches, high schools, colleges, mental health conferences and other community events.
Speaker 2:So Scott's program is titled Seeing in Color Again a Firefighter's Post-Traumatic Success Story. It is the story of a firefighter's journey of survival and message of hope for those who have PTSD, addiction and suicidal thoughts. Scott is a pioneer and talked about the topic when it was being swept under the rug and before it was acceptable to talk about. Topic when it was being swept under the rug and before it was acceptable to talk about. He is speaking out of his life-changing, about his life-changing story, in hopes of helping others recognize PTSD symptoms and help prevent them from going down the same path that he did. His presentation has been credited with turning many people's lives around and saving lives. So, scott, you've done a lot and you've been through a lot, and I feel like you have a very good story to tell. So thank you for being on the show.
Speaker 3:Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2:You know, being that you have a 24 year um career in firefighting. You know, one of the biggest things that we talk about here at hometown, here outdoors is, you know, our outdoor adventures. But mental health is the goal. So I know you've been to a couple of our events. It sounds like up in Eagle Bend, is that accurate?
Speaker 3:Yes, yeah.
Speaker 2:And that's our annual barbecue that we host up there called Barbecue Boot Camp, and that's where you got connected with us. Do you want to talk?
Speaker 3:about how you got connected with the organization and how you attended that. Yeah, I met Steve and I'm not even going to try to pronounce his last name, but he's from Eagle Bend, he's a firefighter and he's heard me speak and he asked if I'd come and speak at their barbecue and I did not know what to expect. But wow, that is an event that it's absolutely amazing. I mean to have the professional cookers come in and share their secrets and share their tricks on how to cook brisket and chicken and pork butt and all the steaks, and it's just really cool to have that one-on-one conversation with those guys.
Speaker 2:It is. Yeah, no, it's a phenomenal event. People are always excited to go to it. I think we've had some repeat members go to it that just absolutely look forward to it, and I think it's great that you were able to go there and speak to everyone.
Speaker 2:You know, and a couple of years back, our mission did not include firefighters, but we expanded that and that was our intent from the beginning. We just wanted to make sure that we understood what we're doing before we went there, and I think it's great that the firefighter community is involved, because you guys do go through stuff as well. You know, I think all first responders have their own dynamic of different things that they engage with and can be affected differently, and you know the recent stats that I saw regarding firefighters and having suicidal thoughts is high, and attempts made or a plan for attempts is also high, and that can't be overlooked. And I think it's great that you're here and um, you know that you are continued to share your story with others and help turn people's experience around. But let's start with your career. Let's talk about who Scott is, where you came from, how you got into firefighting, where you live, um, start from there.
Speaker 3:Uh well, I. I grew up in Detroit lakes, Minnesota, and from there I became a mechanic and moved to Frazee, minnesota, which is just 10 miles down the road, and when I moved there, one of the firefighters that worked at the dealership that I worked at approached me and asked me if I wanted to be a firefighter. I never thought of it and next thing, you know, I filled the application out and I became a firefighter. And it's a small town, 1,300 population, so we're a volunteer firefighter, fire department and, yeah, wow, fire department became like a second family to me and it was amazing the things I learned and the camaraderie it was. It was absolutely amazing just to get to know everybody in town through the fire department.
Speaker 2:Yeah's, the communities are close in it, especially in those smaller communities. I mean the large cities too, but those small communities, especially in the fire world, even law enforcement, um, they, they are very close in it and, uh, they become family for sure. Like what you just said and that's something that's been said several times on this podcast is how, even with the military world or anyone that we serve, you know, they they do become family and integrate with yourself and they are a support system for you. And so what is your journey through the fire department? Look like, what are some of the things that you encountered, or things that you had to go through, or some of the struggles, the ups and downs, like what are the things that stand out to you that you'd like to speak about?
Speaker 3:Well, as a mechanic by trade, I was really focused in on auto extrication the jobs of life. We had a lot of mechanics on the fire department and we got pretty good at doing auto extrication because we knew the vehicles and that kind of got me in a position where I was seeing a lot of fatalities. So yeah, I mean, over the years I went from I moved up the ranks pretty quick to captain to assistant chief, doing a lot of the extrication trainings, and I loved it. It was fun and yeah, it came with some side effects, though you know I thought I was bulletproof and I was this firefighter and new things were bothering me.
Speaker 3:But suck it up attitude in a small community. We're recognizing the people in the cars, but you know there was so much other stuff on the other side of it that the pancake feeds and the fun stuff that we're doing with the community and and the uh, the school, you know, having the kids down to the fire station, let them. Let them, you know, spray the hose and be in trucks. And the fire prevention was awesome. It was just I got a high from it giving back to the community.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, and those small town relationships like you just talked about too. You know, yeah, and those small town relationships like you just talked about too, you know those can be very difficult to handle because you do show up to calls with people that you do know and can stick with you for quite a while and in times it even sticks with you when you don't know what it's going to. You know it can come up later down the road, down the road. So you're talking about some of your, the community involvement that you had the highs, the lows, being able to engage with the fun times but also some of the other complications that came with that. You know you thought you're bulletproof. So what did? What did that look like? What was Scott being bulletproof? What were the complications or issues that kind of arose over time?
Speaker 3:Well, you know, when you've taken cuts of a body out of a car and you recognize them, or out of a fire or something, and you're walking down the street the next few days or a week, two weeks later, and you know you're face-to-face with their loved ones and you just it's difficult. You know you have everything together one second and then all of a sudden you can't speak and you get embarrassed and you feel guilty. And sometimes I'd have to walk across the street and I was avoiding people, avoiding businesses that were owned by, you know, family members or something like that. And yeah, I felt bulletproof, like that. And yeah, I felt bulletproof. But at the same time, you know, there was, there was a part of me that felt like I was failing people, like I was weak, like I was defective, and that kept growing and growing.
Speaker 3:And the bad part about it was, as first responders, we're helpers, we're always out there helping the community and we don't do too well of a job helping ourselves. And I fell into that. You know, who am I supposed to go ask for help? You know I'm a firefighter, I'm helping everybody else, so I can't call 911. I mean, I don't know what's going on with my life with, all of a sudden, the nightmares and the flashbacks and the crosses alongside the road. It's like I'm supposed to be better than this. You know I'm supposed to be able to handle this.
Speaker 2:So I sucked it up and, uh, it just kept growing like an infection inside me, and you know it's a lot of people go through that. A lot more than that there needs to be, you know, and not saying there's any shame in that at all, cause there isn't. The same time, it's what you do with it which is important. I think that you know, as you said in your bio earlier, you know you started talking about these things prior to them being more common, um, and I think it is becoming more prevalent where people are discussing some of these mental health issues that they do encounter in their first responder military career. And, uh, you know it does lead to things like avoidance and I've experienced that myself.
Speaker 2:I once lost a, and you know it does lead to things like avoidance and I've experienced that myself. I once lost a close friend. You know that was up in the Mille Lacs area, one of the first ones on that call, and watched him pass away, you know. And then I was very close to this family and a lot of avoidance did happen there, you know where, you know I he used to own a local store and I wouldn't go in there. You know I was very close with his wife and his children and the avoidance does happen, um, and, and that's a sign that we need to recognize in order to move forward and to begin to heal a bit. But you know, as we went through your bio too, you know you talked about not only the avoidance piece, but you know some of the mental health issues and addictions. Do you want to speak about that?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I my shop. I built a shop in Frazee, but before that I rented a place that was right across from the bar and it made it way too convenient for me to go across the street after work and it got to the point where I was shutting down the bar. I was staying down there, you know, after I got done working all night long and I'd go home and I had two sons at home and a girlfriend and I started isolating from them. Something took over. You know I'd rather be around my friends shooting pool than around my family. That wasn't right. It was, you know, the isolation at the shop. Trying to work harder, work more, you know, to keep my mind busy. So I went home and sat and watched TV. That's when things would catch up to me, even around my kids. You know, there was times when we were at the playground and the kids, you know, screaming, having fun at the playground, also sounded like the kids that were screaming in the car accidents or the parents that were screaming in the car accidents. There got to be a lot of triggers.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, I just changed and in the addiction I started doing a little meth with some friends. That's something I never believed in. I never believed in drugs doing drugs. But here were some of my friends not firefighters, but some of my friends from the area and I got into doing some meth. And after a while I found out hey, you know, this isn't that bad, I'm not going to get addicted to this if I just use it once or twice a month. But as it went on I started to use it to work more hours, to stay awake from my nightmares, and it caught up with me. It got to the point where I was at the end. I was doing a line an hour. I had to have the math. It owned me, it took me over.
Speaker 2:That's a lot of math and sorry to hear that you know. I think it's great that you recognize that and move forward, but I'm sure it was not easy. You know what did that journey look like? Oh man.
Speaker 3:It got to the point where every time I closed my eyes I was seeing my kids falling out of the sky on fire, or they were trapped in a car and I couldn't get the jaws of life going and I was replacing my kids with the people that I pulled out of the vehicles and it got very personal and the nightmares and night terrors, night, you know, night was not my friend. Sleeping was definitely not a not a good thing for me and that's not a good place to live. Sleep deprivation was getting to me when I used the meth to stay awake. That was the turning point. After a while my fiancée, my girlfriend she left me. I had no reason to go home anymore. That's when I started doing a lot of meth. Trying to kill myself with the meth I figured I'd have a stroke and being locked up in my shop all the time. They'd never get to me in time wow, yeah, um, that's difficult.
Speaker 2:Those are probably some really dark times and that that does consume people and some people don't make it back from that. What? What was the moment when you were like something's got to change. What are the things that I need to do to make myself better and be in a better place for myself and my family? Like, what was that moment?
Speaker 3:Well, unfortunate for me, it it went really downhill. I went I mean, it was a basement, a basement, a rock bottom. It was after an argument I got into with my girlfriend it wasn't really an argument, it was all one-sided I just started yelling at him and yelling at my kids. I mean, the anger was out of control. And that was even before the meth, the PTSD. I didn't know what PTSD was, but the anger of taking it out on my loved ones. And one day I was at the apartment her apartment and I yelled at him.
Speaker 3:And as I was driving down to the shop after that and I threatened suicide like I usually did, I was driving down to the shop and I was sitting there thinking about my hit list. I had a hit list. I had a list of people I was going to take out before I was going to take an end to my life. I mean, I was at that point and I told myself on the way down to the shop I said this is stupid, I've turned into a monster and I've got to stop myself Because I'm going to put this city on the map in a very bad way and my kids are going to have to live with that. So it was kind of weird that I had kind of a sense of clarity that I had to do something.
Speaker 3:Unfortunately, I took the wrong path and I sat down in my shop and I tried to end my life with a revolver. And, man, I tell you what, when that hammer came down, that thing was supposed to do its job and the hammer came down and never touched a primer, but it clicked. And that's when I did a Google search clicked. And that's when, uh, that's when I did a google search, I my, my fingers danced across the keyboard and anger, flashbacks, nightmares and and and drugs, and I hit enter and ptsd filled the screen. I'm like, wait a minute, I can't have ptsd. I've never been in the military, you know.
Speaker 3:So I, I did some research on it and that was the turning point when I seen PTSD and yes, first responders are high risk for PTSD and I'm like this explains everything. And that's when things turned around, and you know, having to get to that point where I pulled the trigger, that it sucks that I had to go that far and I'm so grateful that I'm here and I just hope that other people reach out before they get to that point, because, man, I I can't imagine what my family would have been like without me, what the last 10 years would have been like without me here, because, man, it's awesome. Life is so much different since I reached out and got the help I needed. You said that was 10 years ago. That was on July 22nd, actually, of 2014. So I'm coming up on my 10-year anniversary, but I'm not celebrating a suicide attempt. I'm celebrating the day that I found out I had PTSD and the day I reached out for help and my life turned around.
Speaker 2:No, it's great. I'm glad you are here and I think you have a very story that could probably resonate with a lot of people, and I'm sure you've seen that through your additional career after that and your recovery and yeah, that's a lot. I can only imagine what kind of uphill climb it was after that. You know the recovery piece and the treatment and whatever journey you had beyond that and being able to move forward also was likely not easy, right, yeah?
Speaker 3:However, for me, I started making phone calls and unfortunately, back in 2014, I didn't get much.
Speaker 3:The suicide hotline I called didn't answer and some other phone numbers didn't work. But finally I got a hold of a firefighter through a hotline out on the East Coast and he stopped everything and was there for me and he gave me contacts for other people, other firefighters that understood PTSD and understood addiction, and they stopped everything just to talk with me. I mean, they were willing to jump on a plane to come meet me because I was very suicidal. But they, they helped me understand what therapies were out there for me. They actually gave me a phone number, so I I got an appointment for the very next morning to start therapy. They bent over backwards for me and if it wouldn't have been for them, I would have never made it. And the thing is, since then I've seen this happen, not just with helplines, but with just anybody, just being there for you, because coming and sitting and being present with them and saying, hey, you know, I don't want you to go, I want to be here for you, you're important and you matter.
Speaker 2:We need you in this world. Yeah, that means peer support networks are significant and, uh, you know, like us at HHO, none of us are mental health providers. We are people that care and, uh, we have some training to assist you, but we're not going to treat you from start to finish. You know we are here as friends and peers to stand you up, and that's exactly what you experienced. It sounds like Yep.
Speaker 3:It's good.
Speaker 3:And it's kind of had a ripple effect, because now I've been able to be there for others. And you know, in that time they reach out to me and a lot of times it's like hey, here, my, you're my last call, you're all I've got. And it's like, hey, here are my, here are my last call, you're all I've got. And it's like well, I'm glad you called because we're going to get through this together too, just like that guy told me, we're going to get through this together, we've gotcha, and that that's exactly the same words I use for them, because I'm not going to let them go. I'll be there for them.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, and that's a common thing that we need to increase. Doing more is being there and being there together, and we have it happen in the organization quite frequently and unfortunately. But I'm glad people are reaching out and asking. It's the ones that don't that we're trying to help change and get that mentality where. We are there for them and we do mean it. And you had good friends that circled around you and stood you up and started to move you forward. That's good. So when you came to the fact where you got this help, you started that therapy appointment. What did that journey look like?
Speaker 3:That was interesting. They told me about something called EMDR Eye Movement Descent Station Reprocessing and it's something I'd never heard of before and they told me that it's helped a lot of their firefighters and this guy was from the East Coast the one that helped that answered that phone call. But he also connected me with a New York firefighter and a police chief from Chicago so I could call him any time and and they dropped everything just to be there for me, even if it was just 10 minutes or sometimes it was an hour. And they told me about the EMDR, they told me about the results that other firefighters and first responders have had and and I tell you what I I I kind of made a mistake at Google in it, because I was a Google freak. I Googled PTSD, I Googled EMDR and man, I was looking at this stuff. I was like, well, this stuff looks like witchcraft, this looks like voodoo. I don't know about this stuff.
Speaker 3:They're going to hypnotize me and have me clucking like a chicken and I don't know about this, but I started the process and after the very first EMDR therapy, when I started talking about the car accidents see, we never debriefed, we didn't have any debriefings. After these bad calls, we went home, back to our families, back to work or whatever, or to the bar, you know, we didn't talk about it. So finally, I was doing these debriefings years after these things happened, years after all this torment you know they tormented me, the demons were just eating me up. Years after that I was finally letting it out and it was awesome. I mean I that that first session I felt like I was a hundred pounds lighter and driving home from that session is where my the title of my program came in seen in color again, because it was in August of 2014.
Speaker 3:I was driving on highway 10 by Fargo and there was a sunflower field and I stopped my car and had to walk out into the sunflower field because I couldn't believe what I was seeing. I was seeing colors again. I didn't realize how dark and gray and full of shadows my world had become until, all of a sudden, all the colors came back and it was like neon signs. I mean, I could tell you what color something was, but it was just amazing the colors and the houses that appeared, that were there for you know five, ten years, but I had blinders on.
Speaker 2:So your brain was able to kind of refocus a bit and be able to see the vibrance and everything that was going on around you versus, you know, when it was suppressed. Is that accurate?
Speaker 3:yeah, I mean, I processed the stuff that my brain never processed, and a lot of that had to do with the ptsd and then the meth on top of that, not sleeping, so I never got into the REM mode of sleep, and that affected me too, because you go into the REM mode of sleep is when your brain is processing things and putting it away the way it's supposed to be, and I never gave my brain an opportunity to do that. And that's where the debriefings are so important that when you debrief, you talk about it and you get it out and you hear other people talk about it and it helps you process them.
Speaker 2:No, it makes sense. You know, I think they're a lot more common now. You know, back in the day they were not, you know, I think back into my early career even. You know, some of our debriefings never happened, like that friend I talked about. No, I never really had a formal debriefing about that, and then another situation at that. After that, I never had a debriefing, but they are important.
Speaker 2:You know, it's being able to, um, recognize the different things that you witnessed and went through and, um, it does do something in your brain. You know, and you talked about emdr, and I've done that as well, and it's, it's, uh, I, I feel you, though, like when you're talking about witchcraft. You know, you hear about the different things, the eye movements or the paddles, um, that vibrate in your hands. You know it is different, um, but I, you know it is different, but I think you know, embracing it and understanding that you know it's an attempt to begin to process all the things that you've been through and you observe does begins to segment things in a way that you can process them and navigate those situations better, and it's very interesting. It's the science behind it is incredibly interesting, and being able to read about how the brain reacts to different things like the eye movement and the vibrations, and it's more common now and I know they're still doing more research on how to develop it even further.
Speaker 3:So that's pretty interesting that you said that you went through it too, because I literally just did it and, uh, it's, it's pretty cool yeah, back in 2016, they invited me down to minneapolis for their international association of embr, their their conference, and, uh, they just invited me down there and I chatted with the board of directors. Next thing, you know, hey, you're getting up on stage and you can tell your story. I'm like, wow, so I was the only one in the room that didn't have a bachelor's degree and there was 800 therapists in there and it was live fed to I don't know how many other countries, but it's just like you know. Yeah, I'll do that. I mean, I'm not afraid to talk and tell my story because I don't want anybody to go where I was and if my story can help others reach out and you know, see that there's light at the end of the tunnel, there is a way out that PTSD is not a life or death sentence. There's ways out of this and, yeah, it's post-traumatic success.
Speaker 2:No, and that is that kind of the kickoff to more of your career beyond that, when it came to being more involved with speaking publicly and getting involved with different organizations or groups to engage in discussing some of the things that you went through as well as you know what others can do to help themselves.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I, when I went through this, as soon as I started going through therapy and I got better and I walked away from the meth all by myself after that first session, I just I didn't want that life anymore and I never, ever thought I'd be free of meth. I never thought I'd be free of the nightmares and the demons. But when I got free of that I couldn't shut up about it. I told I started with the neighborhood, I started with my fire department and then it moved to the fire departments around me.
Speaker 3:And the next thing, you know, people were wanting me to come in and speak because, you know, nobody was talking about it. We were sweeping it under the rug and it was the elephant in the room that you can't sweep under the rug. And when I started talking nationally well, even locally, the look on people's faces and I knew I wasn't the only one and the phone calls that people were reaching out and talking and wanting to meet with me and talk about what they went through. Because trust was there and everything I do is confidential when I meet with people and I don't charge. I've been blessed enough to. You know I can't hop on a plane, but you know I've been blessed enough that I can travel a little bit.
Speaker 2:I take my speaker fees and stuff like that and use it towards helping one-on-ones so you're really doing some good work over there, you know, with being a resource to other individuals who need that, and it does happen quite often where you, when you start sharing your story and giving everyone a deep dive into your life and where you've been, that it does resonate with people, and sometimes you're surprised by the people that do reach out, and that's good, though. I mean, that's the point of sharing your journey, right.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and also, you know, explaining the signs and symptoms without using a PowerPoint, without putting just words up on a screen. I mean, what is isolation? You know I explain isolation by, you know, avoiding my family and staying down at the shop and thinking I'm working more hours to make more money. But actually I'm isolating. And the nightmares and the flashbacks and the recklessness. You know that getting up on a house fire and jumping up on the roof, the first guy up there knowing the damn roof isn't safe, or going into a house fire that I would never send anybody in. But you know, I wanted to die a hero and in the back of my mind I really didn't value my life much, but I didn't want anybody else to risk their life coming after me. So it was weird how I always looked behind me and looked around me to say, hey, if I fall through this floor, is anybody going to come after me?
Speaker 2:Because I don't want anybody else to get hurt.
Speaker 3:It's weird, you know, looking back at it, I was really messed up. And to be able to come out of this and physically be in good shape, I mean the meth. I snorted it, so I got on my teeth still and it didn't do any permanent damage. I'm just incredibly fortunate.
Speaker 2:That's great. Do you want to talk about your program Seeing in Color? Again A little bit more about that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, basically I just I use a very short PowerPoint, but it's not a PowerPoint like a lot of people use. It's just some illustrations of what PTSD looks like through some artists and I show some before and after pictures of what I looked like and the darkness in my eyes compared to the color in my eyes, and I do my presentation. I'll do it in front of almost anybody. I've had really good results with schools, with high schools. I want to go upstream. I want to prevent this. I want them to understand what depression, anxiety, ptsd, addiction, and if there's a way out and it's okay to reach out and talk to somebody.
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Speaker 2:I want to talk about being a mental health practitioner. Have you received formal education?
Speaker 3:on that. It's interesting because I worked in mental health crisis stabilization for four and a half years. I have not went to school for mental health or psychiatry or psychology or whatever. I haven't done any schooling for it. I got it through experience through the hours. I haven't done any schooling for it. I got it through experience through the hours.
Speaker 3:I had 4,000 hours working with people in crisis and that's not all first responders, by no means. That was just the general public. They're suicidal or whatever, and we'd help them get back on their feet and get it back to the workforce, get housing, get their appointments all set up and their medications and get them back out into the society. And yeah, I kind of fell into that. I was asked to work for them and it was a really good fit. I learned a lot about the mental health side of it. I learned a lot of times their hands are tied and that's kind of why I got out of it.
Speaker 3:I answered crisis lines and that was the toughest thing to do is have to follow the policies that they have in place for their liabilities. If I have somebody that's suicidal, I go with my heart, I go with my experience, I go with what's the track record of working and you know I don't have this license sitting over my head. You could say I get to go above and beyond. If somebody wants to go have a beer with me in the evening and talk about things, I'll go have a beer with them. I'll meet with them after hours during the day, go for coffee, go for a drive in a car, meet them out in the middle of nowhere. I'll go that extra mile for them.
Speaker 2:Where your license holders can't.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so I was working under somebody else's license, so I didn't. I couldn't put that at risk, so I always had that. You know I was, I was worried about that. You know like I have to follow these rules and yeah, it was difficult for me. Plus, I was speaking so much that it was hard to hold down the job, so I decided to go full-time speaking.
Speaker 2:And you travel all over for that. Where are the different places your speaking has taken you?
Speaker 3:All over the US East Coast, west Coast, texas, florida I speak at something called the First Responder Bridge Retreat. I speak at something called the First Responder Bridge Retreat. It's for first responders that are having difficulties with their marriage or maybe diagnosed with PTSD maybe not diagnosed with PTSD yet, but having issues with mental health or addiction, suicidal thoughts and it's a free retreat. It's down in Columbus, ohio. All you have to do is pay for your transportation to get there and they put you up in a beautiful hotel and they got some really top notch speakers and information for both them and their significant others. They're both invited. They everything's paid for. The meals are paid for. Once you're there, everything's covered.
Speaker 2:That's cool, that's pretty incredible.
Speaker 3:That's four times a year they do it. I wish other states would pick up on it and duplicate it, but they've. They've been doing this so long that they have the sponsors that it would. It takes a long time to get that built up to be able to do something like that, but it's it's. It's changed so many lives.
Speaker 3:I don't know how many people have, uh, have just walked up to me and said they're ready to take their life and if it wasn't for that retreat they would have been gone and the marriages that were saved, they, they show up, the couples show up and sometimes they're in separate rooms and they get down to the, to the event and the speakers start and there's like a wall between the couple and I'm one of their opening speakers and it's amazing, when I'm up on stage, that sometimes a significant other will look at the first responder and you just see it. It's like why haven't you been talking about this stuff? Why don't you share this with me? And by the end of the first day they're holding hands and it's just repairing things and helping them communicate.
Speaker 2:That's fantastic. You know, I went through a training called Breach Point retired police chief out of Michigan, and that's a training that's very well integrated with something similar to what you spoke about with spouses, you know, and kind of eye opening as to, you know, maybe some of the signs they've seen or things that they haven't heard and why. You know, I think that those are very influential in people's careers and mental health, especially with, like you said, saving careers and relationships and lives. You know, it's all very important, it's not just one facet, it's all of them. With HHO, you know. Essentially, you know, being able to get people an outlet to go and do stuff with like-minded people and or family on our trips, that helps with those situations as well.
Speaker 2:On a smaller scale, you know, I think when you can directly attach or address the issues, like you just talked about for your retreat, those are very, very uh influential and helping with healing and understanding. I think that's the big piece is understanding why someone may be a certain I shouldn't say a certain way, but what that kind of helps them understand what they've seen and observed. And I think that sounds like a very fantastic retreat and hopefully it's a resource to those who may be listening and that sounds like a very fantastic retreat and hopefully it's a resource to those who may be listening and we can share that on our social media stuff to point people in a direction if they're looking like they want to try something like that. I think that's a very, very cool thing that's happening and that you're doing. Yeah, it's.
Speaker 3:It's not my event, I'm just part of it.
Speaker 2:I'm just yeah, no totally yeah, no, and I mean, even if a small piece, you know it all makes a difference. You're there for a reason, right? Um?
Speaker 3:there was no way. I I was, I was the, I was the bad side of it, you know, and I can't take all the credit for that. But, um, my relationship issue. I had a lot of relationship issues. I just couldn't love anybody and it was because of the stuff that happened in my life and and the things I saw. I just couldn't get close to anybody because all I could focus on was the death.
Speaker 3:And once I got my therapy done, it opened up my eyes. I mean, I was single but I was out having fun and I was 100%, totally happy being single and being alone and I was happy with myself. And then I met a gal and I tell you what the relationship we have now and the communication and she calls me out on my BS. I mean she'll, if I start acting out, it's like hey, scott, time to make a phone call. I've got safety plans, I've got a crisis plans, I've got support systems, and it's not just her, but you know she calls me out on it and say, hey, I think we need to date night, we need to go talk, we you know what's going on and she'll sit me down and I mean no guy likes to be sat down and have a conversation Right.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:But you know what? I accept it and it's like, yeah, you're right, I can't let you.
Speaker 2:I got to let you in. I can't. You spoke about, I think is that's cool that you can recognize that and have that there. You know, I think you know where you've been and where you've gone and what to do to prevent that in the future.
Speaker 2:I recently met a gentleman who has an entire family that has suffered from addiction and he had a suicide attempt himself, with narcotics as well, and he's recognized that and he's changed it. One of the things is that he said that I'm wired a certain way and I need to recognize that and what do I do to adapt that? You know so when you talk about having a safety plan or a crisis plan, he had something similar and his issue that he communicated was idle time. When he had idle time, things got difficult. So he showed us his cell phone and he had probably had about 30 alarms set in his cell phone where he had set apart specific times of the day, all day, every day, with alarms to be engaged in a certain activity to keep his mind wired on what was at hand, versus having that idle time.
Speaker 2:I know for some that probably is a very difficult thing, you know, having that many alarms go off, but some people recognize that they need to have that plan in place in order to not go back to a place where they were, and I thought that was pretty interesting, you know. I think he figured out what worked for him, you know, and he's a very successful individual now and like your plans. I think that it's very critical for people to recognize what are the things that may trigger going backwards or being in a place where they need assistance again, and I think that's awesome.
Speaker 3:And my safety plans have phone numbers on them contacts and my safety plans have phone numbers on them contacts and the agreement I make with the people that I call is I tell them I want you on my safety plan. Will you be able to answer the phone call? I've got three people, but you know, if you can't answer it, can you get back to me as soon as possible? And they agree to that. And I say this is how this is going to work, though, because I know from experience and from talking to other people that, because I know from experience and from talking to other people, that little green button on your phone is really difficult to call somebody when you're hurting because you think you're bothering them.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 3:And you don't want to be that person bothering them. So I make the agreement with them that if they want to be on my safety plan, I'm on their safety plan. So if they are ever hurting, I want them to call me. Because I put that on them, because it's like, how would you like it if I don't call you when I'm hurting? And they said, well, no, you better call me. It's like, exactly that goes back towards you too. I don't want to hear that you were having a bad day and you didn't make a 10 minute phone call to me and we could have made things better.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:So I kind of it's a two two way street.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's makes sense. I mean, I think it gives a little bit of ownership on both people, you know, and but also support, you know, and I think that ownership with that is the support and that's fantastic. Is there anything else you want to talk about? The safety plan? You know people might be listening that want to know more about a safety plan. Is and what that looks like actually supposed to do another podcast with a state agency from a different state. They wanted me to talk about gun safety, gun security, safe storage. We agreed not to do it because I didn't share their views.
Speaker 3:I do believe in being able to have protection. I don't have kids in the house, but they did ask some pretty good questions about you know what could have been done different to when you used a weapon. And it's like, well, if I went to have a weapon, I would have probably found a different way, because when you're suicidal, you're suicidal. However, I talk to people now and it's like, if you're going to have a gun in the house, and you're going to have a gun in the house and you're going to be using it or wherever, and if you're suicidal, you know what you're going to do. You know what gun you're going to use most likely. So here's what I want people to do is put a little safety net. Get a letter, get something from your significant other, from yourself even, or a picture of your kids. I want them to lay it on top of that gun. You don't want the gun exposed anyway, so put a picture of your kids on, put a buffer. So if you're reaching for that gun when you're in a really bad mode, in a really bad place, and you have a piece of paper on there saying we need you, we love you, and that might be just enough to slow you down and get your brain thinking a little bit, or a picture of your kids, just something to slow you down. It's not going to hurt because I tell you what somebody's in your house, that little piece of paper is not going to get in the way.
Speaker 3:If you need to defend yourself, true, but you know, if you're going to have the guns around, that's my, you know. A little safety thing, I guess you know, to slow you down in an event of a suicide, just to kind of break your mindset. And hey, you know God, you're going to hurt them. You know you're not. It's not just about you. It's going to hurt people around you and you are needed in this world Absolutely. And I mean if I can go from where I was I mean stuck in a meth addiction like that. I mean where I had to carry three, 22 shells around with me full of meth because I couldn't go an hour without meth and if I could break that cycle and break the suicidal thoughts and the PTSD and come out, you know, being able to help other people no-transcript.
Speaker 2:That's important.
Speaker 1:This is your financial cop money minute.
Speaker 4:Let me ask you this If I gave you a hundred dollars, which would you rather have, $20 back or $80 back, 80 back? So if you take a hundred dollars in interest and you write that off your taxes, what you're saying is I'd rather give the bank 80 bucks so that I don't have to give the federal government 20 in the right. I'd rather have the $20 go to the federal government and keep $80 myself. So the whole tax write off equation of this just doesn't compute. When you dig into the math it's kind of like you'll hear financial advisors say don't pay your house off, invest in the market, because your mortgage is 3% but you can get 10 in the market. Well, that's a play on marketing words.
Speaker 4:If I do the math with the interest rates, that works. If I change the equation to the dollar amount, it doesn't anymore. Unless you have $300,000 to put in the market. Because if you make an extra principal payment on your house and that saves you $800 in interest on the back end of your loan, but that $1,000 goes in the market and it makes 10% this year, what did it make? It made a hundred bucks. So same kind of equation. It's just again. This is why I studied the marketing aspect just as much as I did the millionaires, because it's just a play on the numbers to make it look good in that perspective versus another perspective.
Speaker 1:This is your financial cop money minute.
Speaker 2:So what are your future plans look like? Where are you going from here? What? What is the big plans of Scott with sharing your story and moving forward?
Speaker 3:I'm looking at starting some new trainings, some suicide prevention awareness trainings, and it's going to be through not the evidence-based stuff that's out there, but it's going to be the experience-based what's worked for me, because I've seen so much of this evidence-based stuff that I'm not sure where they get their information from. But it's way out there and they're not going upstream far enough. I want to go upstream and I want to prevent suicides. I want people to understand that it's okay to reach out for help, it's okay to reach out to somebody else and talk with them and ask them if they're thinking about suicide, and I just want to make sure that people that have had a suicidal experience some of them can be okay sharing their experience to help others?
Speaker 2:How do people get a hold of you if they want to learn more or talk to you?
Speaker 3:My website is seenincoloragaincom. That's S-E-E-I-N-G in color again, and if you just Google my name you'll find a whole bunch of stuff. My phone number's out there, email's out there, website and the website has the different trainings and all that on there. No, it's just got contact information and some of the things I've been doing.
Speaker 2:Okay, and then that's where they can contact you too, if they want to have you come out and speak.
Speaker 3:Yeah, right now I'm just basically doing my speaking engagement, just sharing a one-hour journey, a very short, short PowerPoint, which basically is more about things that have worked. It's not like a PowerPoint, like a lot of people come in and share these stuff you can find on the Internet. Share these stuff you can find on the internet. This is a fun, uplifting, informative presentation. I guess I've had people say that they don't listen to the kids when they go into the schools, that they don't keep their attention for more than 10 minutes. I keep their attention for an hour. They like it when firefighters come in and I share my story and I don't hold anything back. They like it when firefighters come in and I share my story and I don't hold anything back. Our kids have more experience in life than we ever did at least me when I was back in school.
Speaker 2:Yeah, times have changed.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:That's for sure.
Speaker 3:And it's amazing how at one event at the school one of my first ones at school a student walked up to me and asked me a lot of personal questions about my life and and later that day I found his dad called me and he was a firefighter. And he said his son came home and asked him if he was suicidal. He had plans and he was one week away from killing himself. His son saved his life. So I mean, and he's? And his dad said, man, it just rocked his world. He said when my son asked me if I was suicidal and I keep in contact with him a little bit and he said that was the turning point in his life.
Speaker 2:Wow, that's incredible. Well, sharing your story, you know that helps everything and I was going to ask you too, like what has done for you. You know in your healing what everything. And I was going to ask you too, like what what has done for you.
Speaker 3:You know, in your healing, what kind of journey has that brought you on? Um, it's, it's been amazing. I faith is another big part of my journey. Um, I did the therapy but I also. I also had to have my faith back and and as much as I was blaming everything on on God, you know it all kind of looking back, it's like it's a journey I had to go through to.
Speaker 3:You know, get the experience, if you want to call it that um, I had to get drugged through the mud to be able to do what I'm doing now. Like I can't judge anybody because, man, I've done some stupid things in my life. But but you know it's, there's also this side where it's the ptsd. It's not you, it's, it's a, it's something that takes over you and it makes you do some really bad things. I wish I could take back the things I've done to my kids and the words I've said. I've never physically abused them, but the verbal abuse was horrible and I wish I could take those words back. But my kids are pretty resilient and we talk a lot now and at one time they wouldn't talk to me for a couple of years.
Speaker 3:But set up some boundaries, yep, the relationships built back up and they see the change. And my son, after my suicide attempt, um, right before christmas that same year, I was in fargo christmas shopping and I looked at my son and he was 13 and I said, man, I'm really glad that gun didn't go off. And and he said, dad, the gun did go off, it killed the bad dad. And that's when I knew my anger was under control. He said that that monster is gone. And it was just, you know be, it was just that Jekyll and Hyde I mean that, two different people and you can kick ass on that, that monster, and that's.
Speaker 3:That's a very powerful feeling and I can control my anger. And people try to get me angry. There's still people you know that that don't like me from my past that try to trigger me and try to bring that demon out, that monster out, and I, it's weird, I just laugh at them. It's I mean, I don't mean to laugh in their face, but I, I it's like you're not gonna do this to me, right, and it just it really turns, turns them into somebody that I don't want to see them turn into either. But they're not going to, they're not going to own my anger. I can have control of that now.
Speaker 2:Well, that's a pretty, that's a very deep and thoughtful statement from your son Wow, yeah, that's, but also very eyeopening, you know, and and also a little bit of self-reflecting in there as well. When it comes down to, you know that, jacqueline Hyde, you know that something changed at that moment and I'm glad it did. You know it sounds like, uh, you know, people have their own way of thinking about the past and know people can change and people can move forward and, uh, some can't, and sometimes it's the other person you know that has that judgment. And you know we get, we're all human and we have to do better about being compassionate, and, uh, life experiences are here for a reason, you know, and can't change the past, but you can do better in the future, and I think that's the biggest message. But no, it's a very incredible story. So, finally, what message would you like to give to our listeners, particularly those who may be going through some struggles? What is your message to them? To speak?
Speaker 3:to them. I think you touched on it. Don't let the past own you. Tomorrow's a new day. I did a lot of bad things in my past. I'm still not sure if I've 100% forgiven myself for it all, but I've moved forward and I'm using that to be a better person and to help other people. And you know, instead of looking back at all the bad things I've done in my life, I'm looking over the last 10 years and how incredible those 10 years have been. And those 10 years I never, ever, thought I would have. And it all became available to me because I reached out to help get help. You know, reaching out for help was the biggest thing I ever did in my life and it it was difficult. But the other side of the coin was it wasn't easy. Hiding my life I had before and sneaking around the math and and the nightmares and the flashbacks. That was hell. So once I started moving forward and getting the taste of a good life, oh my gosh, I was like a kid in a candy store.
Speaker 2:So there's hope? Oh yeah, that's the big message, is there's hope out there. You know, just got to find it.
Speaker 3:And I'm not the only one. I mean I hear this stuff all the time. I mean I hear this stuff all the time. I mean people that have escaped the darkness and the depths that they were in and they share with how bad they had it and it's like wow, you know it is different stories, you know it might have been abuse or something like that, and it's like, man, you've been through a lot and they realize how strong they are by getting over that and overcoming the PTSD and the trauma.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you know when the PTSD ever goes away. It's just how you handle it. It changes.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and if they talk you know I like how they call it PTSD it's an injury. You know it's not something you went and did, you purposely did. It's something that happened to you. And when I was going through therapy I think that's something that I realized that this was an injury to my brain. It was an infection, and until I took control of that and just like, if I had a cut on my arm and it got infected, I'd go get some antibiotics, Right, Well, my brain had an infection. Something was not right with it, so I went and got some help and therapy was the antibiotics.
Speaker 2:No, it's a very good way of putting it. I haven't thought of it that way before, so that's good perspective. I haven't heard of PTSI before, so that's something that I like. That too. Thanks for sharing that.
Speaker 3:Yeah, there's PTSI, and then there's something else called moral injury that's coming about and that's going to really start to get the headlines too.
Speaker 2:So moral injury.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's hopefully going to get put in the D, the MSI, or yeah, yeah, the book, the fancy book that the professionals have Right, and yeah, cause there's a lot coming about.
Speaker 2:about that too, oh, that's good. Well, I'm glad that society is progressing and things are being talked about and changed and adapted. You know, and you know in our career fields me being law enforcement, you being fire, you know and helping others and changing some of the thought patterns regarding the stigma surrounding our own mental health and reaching out for help. I think that this is some of the steps and you've been on that journey for a while and I appreciate that. But sharing your story has been fantastic and can you just remind everyone how to find you? I know you said Google your name, but what was your website? One more time.
Speaker 3:Seen in color again S-E-I-N-G in color again.
Speaker 2:Cool. Any final comments before we conclude the podcast?
Speaker 3:No, that went great, I think.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely no, it's appreciate you sharing your story and being here. You know, unfortunately too many suicides are successful, you know, and you being here, being able to share how it was not changed your life and you are able to thrive and share that journey with others, I think it's very awesome and being able to go to events like ours at the barbecue, bootcamp and other events around the country and make an impact, and I've I've felt that sharing my story with others has helped others too. Um, and we're all not perfect and I think that there is help out there, a lot of help, and you just got to find the right people and if they're not the right person, find someone. That is, um, but thank you very much for coming on and being here and I hope the listeners enjoyed today.
Speaker 2:One thing I'd like to end with you know is 988 is the suicide prevention and crisis line that you can either call or text and, if you need time of need otherwise, feel free to reach out to Scott if you have the availability to do so, or reach out to Hometown Hero Outdoors. We do train our volunteers in assist training, which is applied suicide intervention skills training, which is a form of crisis intervention that does help other individuals in a time of need or crisis, and we do help implement those safe plans with people. We are not the mental health professionals and we will help you find those if needed. We do have some people that we partner with who can find you additional guidance, but Scott is a good resource here that has been down that road and can give you uplifting information and insight to his journey in order to be in a better place.
Speaker 2:So, thank you, scott, I appreciate you once again and let's stay in contact and we'll we'll put up the website with the podcast and on our social media and just so people can reach out if they need to speak with you. Thank you. Thanks, scott, you have a great day. And all the listeners of Hometown Hero Outdoors podcast. Thank you for tuning in. We will see you in a couple of weeks. Thank you.
Speaker 1:The Hometown Hero Outdoors podcast is sponsored by O'Neill Electric, the Minnesota Police and Peace Officers Association and Relentless Defender Apparel. Thank you for listening to the Hometown Hero Outdoors podcast. For more information, visit our website at hometownherooutdoorsorg.
